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 Bonnie and Damon

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PostSubject: Bonnie and Damon   Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:41 pm

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Discuss Bamon here...
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:41 am

in general. i just can't remember right now.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:56 pm

KrayBaby wrote:
Exactly! It made no sense. Smh.

I liked season 1 flashbacks, and Kat's flashback from season 2 about how she became a vamp. I guess I just really didn't care for flashbacks in season 3 and this season because like you said the Damon retcons.

And season 2 is definitely my favorite. Bonnie was my only fave at the time and she really came into her powers and got to be bad ass and a love interest that didn't want to use her. And then Tyler became my second fave during this season. I liked the plot and the development. Season 1 is a close second though.

What retcon's did you notice in season 2?

I think imo alot Damon's behavior got retcon in flashbacks because idk they were going about trying make look better than Stefan. It bugged me though cause imo Damon in season 1 was upset if not more over Katherine and would want payback for thinking she died. I think moonstone and whole sun and moon thing was retcon/rewritten from it original intention, which may had to do with them trying to hold onto Elijah. Then they said Bonnie's ancestors were from Mystic Falls originally and the founders burned them but I am sure Both Emily and Sheila said they are from Salem area originally. It just little things like that but season 3 was just retcon season in general just so they could the original family and then prop Damon in the finale (cause come on would the Damon we met season 1 act like that and would he really not freak out and Elena was not even drunk like she said she was in season 1 which was the reason she had to be picked up).
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:24 pm

Oh okay, I really haven't watched season 2 in a while so I can't remember a lot of the minor details. But I really don't think at that point Damon would have killed Kat. He was in love with her for so long, that's why he didn't kill her in Masquerade. For me though, I didn't really feel like they started heavy retcons with Damon until season 3. That season was all over the place. I can't say one way or another about the sun/moon curse plot, I do wonder though, what they had planned on doing with Elijah before they made him and Klaus brothers.

I honestly have no idea about the Bennett line and where they originated lol. Oh, but that whole Damon met her first scene was total BS, but most of season 3 was.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:44 pm

The sun and the moon curse was def. to keep Elijah, just like they went to these lame lengths to keep Klaus. I remember back on the v-d.net forum that in the DE thread, there was this interview JP did where she talked about Elijah. I don't remember it word for word but she basically said when she saw how great DG was as Elijah, they created this whole mythology around him to keep him and made him Klaus brother. So before that he was just supposed to be a footsoldier I guess, but then they retconned it so he could be Klaus brother. That's why he was out looking for kat in the flashback, because he was a soldier for Klaus, nothing else. But then they created the Original family and made Elijah Klaus brother. Then the sun and moon curse and all that came about. Just like Klaus last season, giving him a love interest to keep him around, not killing him to keep him around, and making him all the main characters bloodline sire so he can't be killed. All of this stuff was done to keep DG and Jomo around even though they didn't have plans to keep them at all. It's lame if you ask me. No matter how much you love a actor or character, when they no longer serve any purpose you get rid of 'em.

Kray, I disagree that Damon wouldn't have killed Kat in s2. He had already got over her because of her treatment of him, so I do think he wouldn't have hesitated to end her. I think this was shown in 2x01 when she said it'll always be Stefan, and when Elena said the same thing(Damon's my fave character but I laughed when this happened) and he reacted violently. The dude was willing to basically forgive and forget if Kat had given him the answer he wanted, but she didn't. So he let her go and stopped being pathetic over her. You can also see this when he rejects her those times in s2 and 3, and how he shows concern over whether she's still alive or not. He's moved on but he still cares about her and her safety, but if she gets in his way I don't think he'll hesitate. Being on his list doesn't stop you from being killed by him lol. Just look at Alaric, Lmao.

Oh and what retcons of Damon last season? And how was they making him seem better than Stefan? The only flashback I remember was that 1912 one, where Damon causes Stefan to go off the wagon. I don't really remember s3 that much because I blocked that season because it sucked ass. So I don't remember it like you guys apparently do lol.

ETA: lol the 3x22 flashback? I don't think that retconned Damon. He can be nice sometimes, IDK, there was moments he was sweet with Elena in season one when he was going around murdering people and being a dick. Plus it goes with my theory that Damon in season one wasn't switched off at all, and was instead being himself and doing what he learned from katherine way back when.

Do you guys think they planned on going into more details with the whole Bennett/Damon sl and him protecting the Bennett line? It seems like it wasn't really done or complete and there was more to it. I would have liked to see him living up to his end of the bargain, protecting the Bennett line, and watching out for them.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:45 pm

Yea, I know Elijah was only a foot soldier for Klaus, was just wondering what would have happened to him had they not made him Klaus's brother. I really had no issue with Elijah in season 2, I actually quite liked his character and didn't mind the sun/moon curse storyline. But that is just my opinion on it. I do agree though, that after/during season 3 they should have been gone.

I'm not saying he wouldn't have killed Kat. But bamonbaby said she felt like he would have wanted revenge on Kat for leading him to believe that she was in the tomb all of those years. I simply said I don't think it was OOC for him not to lash out on her because he was in love with her, no matter how you slice it. You can't get over someone you been in love with for 145 years after a few days. You can stop pining and being obsessed but I don't think he just fell out of love with her when she said she loved Stefan or whatever, I mean Elena has told him that how many times? And he still loves her. He had the opportunity to kill her and he didn't, he stuck her in a tomb. I don't think think he is in love with her now, though.

When the show started we were lead to believe that Damon had been making Stefan's life miserable. But in the flashbacks of season 3, that is not what we saw. It seemed as though they were slowly trying to retcon Damon from season 1 and how we were told that he was. The flashback of 3x22, was a retcon. Damon came to MF head over heels in love and had one objective in mind: Katherine. So, you mean to tell me that he sees a girl that looks EXACTLY like her and he just compels her away? I don't buy it sorry. And like bamonbaby said, we were told Elena was drunk and that's why her parents had to pick her up, in the flashback she clearly was not. So, yes that flashback was a retcon for me because it did not go with what we were originally told about these characters. Oh, and I never believed Damon was switched off, because if he was how did he care enough about Kat to want to open the tomb?

I do believe they had planned to go more into it and then dropped it. Because the deal could have easily been that Damon just had to protect Emily's kids, in exchange for her helping him get Kat out. But instead they said the Bennett line, so yea I do think it was planned originally.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:50 am

I actually liked Elijah in s2 as well, before they kept him on and made him all noble, honorable, etc, and the thing with Elena. Other than that I used to like him as the villain and enjoyed his screentime. I actually liked Klaus near the end of s2 as well and beginning of s3, before the whole catering to him began. So I liked both characters before the show tried to sell them as more than they were.

Before he stuck her in the tomb didn't he say something about death would be too kind? Or was that someone else? I think he wanted her to suffer like she made him suffer all those years, waiting for the right moment to release her, pining for her, thinking she was desiccated in the tomb, etc, when she was out having fun and doing what she wants. So in a way he put her where she was supposed to be in the first place when he was making plans to rescue her. I mean, he spent all his vampire life in love with this women, planning on getting her out the tomb, doing whatever he could to get to her, then come to find out she never loved him and wasn't even in the tomb like he was led to believe. I would be pissed too and as revenge, stick her in a tomb to be desiccated like she was supposed to be.

I think the only reason Damon didn't attack her was because of the fact she looked like Kat. Obv. he was laying in the road waiting for something to eat, so I think he would have attacked her had she not looked like Kat. I think he hears a voice and goes to attack and feed, or thinks he hears Kat but not sure, then sees it's Kat and stop. Then he realizes it's not Kat and he's breathless that this girl looks like the women he's in love with. I think he's also shocked that there's this girl who has Kat's face, voice, and he's intrigued by her so he leaves her alone. So yeah, I think it's shock and because she looks like Kat, the women he loves.

Besides, he had to had met her before the stuff in 1x01, because he knows about her existence and uses her to taunt Stefan later. Then in 1x03, I think, he's not surprised at all that she looks like Kat. Plus in 1x01 he says seeing Elena took his breath away, and that doesn't happen in 1x03. So I thought it was obvious that he had seen her before or something.

And no, Elena didn't say she was drunk. I remember this because I brought it up in the DE thread back when v-d.net was still active, and the others said she didn't say she was drunk at all. Then I went back and watched, and IIRC she says she ditches family night to go to a party, then gets stranded and has to call her parents to pick her up, and she's the reason they died because they wouldn't have been on the bridge if not for her.

Why did he have to have been making his life miserable though? Because Stefan said so? I think the making his life miserable stuff started in s1, when Damon came back to town. They hadn't even been around each other for awhile right? Didn't Stefan say it had been so and so years before he saw Damon? I think Damon just kept to himself and waited for the opportunity to get Kat out the tomb.

And when Stefan said every time he lets Damon back in and he does something to make him regret it? Isn't that what happened in the flashbacks? In the 1912 one Stefan tried to repair his relationship with Damon, and Damon makes him feed and get off the wagon. The one this season, Stefan tries to repair things with Damon, Damon stands him up. And I'm guessing he knew about the thing with Lexi that Damon did as well. Plus, like Stefan said, Damon had a eternity to kill him but hasn't. He's just there haunting him or whatever he says.

Do you think they'll get back into the Damon/bennetts stuff or do you think it's too late now?
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:25 am

I don't think Kray means that he was going to attack anything it more or so the lines of freaking out and he didn't. He also wouldn't been nice to her either as why would he care when he later does things during the season 1 that rejects her getting everything she wants. As for knowing about her existence since it was stated beforehand he followed Stefan in season 1, I thought it was implied he was just stalking Elena like Stefan did. He also said she took my breath away and none of that was happening. He didn't look shock at all, he just accepted it. It was a retcon cause at the end of the day, who cares he met her first, JP even admitted Elena only said that to him to make Damon feel better.

BTW I am one of the folks still in the camp that once Damon found out Katherine was not in the tomb in season 1, he started projecting his feelings onto Elena. And while people keep saying Stefan may have done the same, I don't believe so cause Stefan prior to meeting Elena had come to realization that Katherine was playing them both and unlike most people I do think Stefan would have rejected Katherine as a vampire had she not compel him not to fear her.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:32 pm

Yea, I didn't mean he should have attacked her, but IMO his reaction wasn't what it should have been considering his obsession with Katherine. I even think from the flashback when Stefan saved Elena, his reaction to seeing her was more than what Damon's was.

Well, of course Elena didn't take Damon's breath away in 1x02 because that wasn't his first time seeing her. Remember he was the crow in 1x01. There is nothing anyone can say to me that will lead me to believe that the 3x22 flashback wasn't a retcon and fanservice. Because it served not a single purpose that he met her first. So yea it was obvious that he had seen her before they first met in 1x02 because he had been stalking her just as Stefan had, just in a different form.

If I'm not mistaken Damon had mentioned he had made Stefan's life miserable as well, not just Stefan saying it. Yes, it was said that they had spent a great portion of the time a part, and if that's the case why is it every flashback Damon isn't as bad to Stefan as they lead us to believe in season 1? That's the point I'm trying to make. And Damon didn't just keep to himself for 145 years. We know for years in NYC he was running around killing people. He's been to college many times. A lot of people seemingly knows him. So yea IMO, since season 3 the writers had been trying to lessen people's views on Damon, and they did it a lot early on in season 4. This is my opinion, and I'm not asking anyone to agree with it.

I seriously doubt the writers will revisit Damon/Bennett line stuff. The only way I can see them doing that is if he and Bonnie become close, but I don't see them going into great detail about it though.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:30 pm

But I thought he wasn't actually the crow? That he was using the crow as his eyes and ears? Well, it's obvious that it was fan service for DE fans to lessen the blow of Elena choosing Stefan last season, but I don't think it actually retcon anything or is OOC for anyone but whatever, agree to disagree.

And when I said he kept to himself I didn't mean he didn't kill anyone or whatever, I meant he wasn't following Stefan around actively trying to ruin his life. I just don't get what would be the point of retconning Damon's past, when he does plenty of horrible shit in the present. So what would be the point?

Quote :
I don't think Kray means that he was going to attack anything it more or so the lines of freaking out and he didn't. He also wouldn't been nice to her either as why would he care when he later does things during the season 1 that rejects her getting everything she wants. As for knowing about her existence since it was stated beforehand he followed Stefan in season 1, I thought it was implied he was just stalking Elena like Stefan did. He also said she took my breath away and none of that was happening. He didn't look shock at all, he just accepted it. It was a retcon cause at the end of the day, who cares he met her first, JP even admitted Elena only said that to him to make Damon feel better.

But he does take a breath after he sees her though. I guess I just don't see what the big deal is, there's plenty of moments in s1 where he's nice to Elena for no reason at all, or he could do something to her and he doesn't. Are those OOC for him as well? I think it was because she has Katherine's face, and since she probably reminds him of his love for Kat he doesn't actually try to hurt her, but at the same time it probably hurts to see this girl with Kat's face, and Kat is locked in the tomb out of his reach. That's my reasoning for him not hurting her for that flashback, and judging by s1 it fits IMO, but YMMV.

How is it a retcon though when it doesn't actually retcon anything, and like you and JP said, it doesn't matter in the long run? What does it retcon? Damon's behavior towards Elena? There's been moments in s1 where's he's extremely lenient towards Elena and doesn't actually retaliate or hurt her, or is nice to her when he has no reason to be. So I didn't see it as OOC for him, as I said before I think it has more to do with the fact she has Kat's face and he loved Kat back in s1. She reminded him of Kat or whatever. And I already explained how Elena never said she was drunk, so it doesn't retcon that.

I take it as it is, a shipper moment to give to DE fans because Elena chose Stefan. But it fits into the timeline and nothing is OOC IMO. I hate s3 and I'm indifferent to that flashback, and I could care less he met her first. I was mad she chose Stefan at first but meh, it was in character for Elena to try to patch things up with Stefan and give them another chance. The flashback did nothing for me because the only reason I came back was because of Damon. But whatever, I'm not trying to change anyone's opinions, you hate it you hate it.

Quote :
BTW I am one of the folks still in the camp that once Damon found out Katherine was not in the tomb in season 1, he started projecting his feelings onto Elena.

I think most of the things Damon did in s1 to Elena was because of Kat. Elena had her face so he would be reminded of her and his love for Kat, so he would sometimes be nice and do things for her, because he was projecting his feelings towards Kat onto her, and he saw her as Kat. Like 1x03 when he's stroking Elena's cheek, that was because he was thinking about Kat, not because he actually had feelings for Elena at that point. So I agree somewhat with you..


ETA: In case you don't want to read the whole thing. Damon's reason for not attacking her in the flashback was because she had Kat's face, and he was in love with Kat to the point of consuming at that point. It was all about Kat and that she had her face, nothing more, nothing less. Even in s1 Damon was nice to Elena or did stuff for her, or let her get away with stuff he didn't let anyone else get away with, and it was because of his infatuation with Kat and love for her, and the simple fact Elena had the face of the girl he loves. So given that, I don't see the big deal but agree to disagree and just ignore my post.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:41 pm

Josh, the point you are missing is that no one is saying he should have attacked her and no one is saying that it was OOC that he didn't attack her. What I am saying is that to me, the way he acted towards Elena didn't really go with the Damon we initially met in season 1.

It was retcon because it changed the backstory to serve a current plot need. It gave Elena something else to remember about Damon when she became a vampire, and it changed what were originally lead to believe in the beginning of the story, and it gave Damon a bone really because had he never compelled her and gotten to know her before she met Stefan then they probably would have been together. So, yea IMO it was retcon based on the definition of what it means. You view the scene differently which is fine, it doesn't affect me at all because I don't specifically ship neither DE or SE just preference of SE.

Anyway, since this is Bonnie and Damon's thread, I would much rather discuss them.

I'm excited to get some Bamon action in 4x19. I wonder if we will get a dance this time!

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:48 pm

I believe that's my point though, not whether he would have attacked her or not. How is the way he acted towards Elena in the flashback any different from how he did in s1 at certain moments? As early as 1x03 he was shown to be stroking her cheeks or whatever. And there was moments where she did something to him, that if it was anyone else he would have reacted violently, but he did nothing. Or there was times where he was lenient with her and was nice for no reason at all. I just don't see how he was acting differently, seeing as he had moments where he shed his dickish behavior and was nice to her for no reason, or did something nice for her for no reason.

But JP said it didn't matter who Elena met first, that it wasn't a game of you met me first so I choose you. That was evident since 4x01, since she didn't run into his arms or anything when she got her memories back, it was just that, a compelled memory. Just like the 2x08 ILY. And what backstory does it change? Everything is still the same, and it changed nothing. And I actually don't care about the flashback at all, DE fan or not, I just don't see how it's a retcon.

But yeah, just ignore my post. Agree to disagree.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:23 am

You just aren't getting it. You keep making it about something that it's not. You keep saying acting in certain moments in season 1, but that's not what I'm talking about. But, I'm not going to get into any longer.

Because clearly while we are on the same page where it comes to most of TVD, DE/Damon isn't one of them lol. I love Damon's character, but I just gotta call it how I see it. I just felt like that scene was out of place. And the shitty thing about it is that Bonnie is the one that met Damon first in the books.

Grrr...

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 08, 2013 8:56 pm

This is the last time then we can move on. You're saying that how Damon acted towards Elena in the flashback was OOC to how he was in s1, and I don't get how. There was just as many moments in s1 where he was nice to her for no reason at all. What's the difference? That's all i'm saying.

Anyway, to answer your previous Bamon question, I think they should dance. They have both of them there after all, so a dance would be nice. Plus they did say there would be lots of shipping moments scattered throughout the episode, so I'll just believe Bamon will dance and have a nice moment tgether.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:06 pm

The difference is those other times wasn't the first time he met her. My point is that for his first time ever in life seeing someone who is an EXACT replica of the reason he was in MF in the first place, his reaction to that to me, just didn't seem right. It was like he did a quick double take and put on the Damon charm as if she wasn't looking like Katherine. For me, I just didn't feel like that's how Damon would have reacted upon first meeting her. I feel like he would have been asking more questions and whatnot. It's just my personal opinion.

Yea, I am hoping for a Bamon dance at least. When JP did was answering questions on twitter after the last episode, a fan asked if we would get some sweet moments for Bamon, Mabekah, or Steroline in 4x19 and she said yes to 2 out of 3. I came to the conclusion that it would be Bamon and Mabekah because we know from the stills that we will get some Mabekah. And I honestly don't believe it will be Steroline because Caroline has Tyler and then Klaus to deal with and I'm sure she will get moments with both of them, and then Stefan will be trying to handle Elena business, so I think we may get a sweet Bamon moment.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:24 pm

Agree to disagree.

I don't get the appeal with Steroline? Why do people want them together? But yeah, I think Caroline will be busy with Klaus and Tyler to have moments with Stefan. Plus Stefan will be focused on Elena so I don't think they'll have any moments.

Do you think it'll just be a dance or more than just that?
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:54 pm

I don't get the appeal of Steroline either, except for a good friendship. I just don't see any romantic chemistry between them TBH. I hate how on shows anytime 2 characters get close or have one intense moment they get shipped romantically together. LIke, why the hell can't people just be friends. I don't think Caroline would ever pursue Stefan after claiming Stefan as Elena's soul-mate. And TBH Stefan will never be completely over Elena, and that wouldn't even be fair of Caroline.

If Bamon did anything more than dance, they would have to call an ambulance because I would be dead LOL. Seriously, I think we may get a dance can't say for sure, just hoping. I think maybe they end up working together because I think this episode will have a lot of SE moments because I think DE will end good in the finale. So I think maybe Damon and Bonnie spend a good portion of the episode together.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:30 pm

I don't get that either. Characters on tv shows can just be friends without it having to be romantic. I don't see any chemistry between them either, just a great friendship. And what you said, it wouldn't be fair to Caroline because Stefan will never completely be over Elena, that's part of the reason I didn't want Stebekah. I think they are over though, since she snapped his neck. But yeah, no steroline, they're better as friends, nothing more.

Yeah I think Damon and Bonnie will spend a bunch of time together, and possibly work together. Maybe they'll work on the Silas stuff together? We'l supposed to see Silas face in 4x19 btw, it came out with the spoilers today. Some actor named Scott Parks will play Silas, but we won't see his real face all the time, he'll still be using others faces.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Wed Apr 10, 2013 1:15 pm

Yea, that's what they do best is work together so I definitely think that's what will happen. I hear Bonnie does a lot of walking around this episode so I'm sure she is handling business.

And thanks, I had read that spoiler about Silas. I also saw that aside from Jeremy there is another big return. So, I guess the veil really gets dropped next week or something.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:11 pm

I think they was also talking about Tyler's return as well. I can't wait to see who all comes back, because carina tweeted that we'll see a lot of dead folks coming back. I think Jeremy, Jenna, Alaric, and Kol? I remember carina saying Kol wouldn't be coming back, but I wonder if that wasn't to throw us off? If he does come back then he'll probably be going to the spinoff with his family.

Man, I can't wait till next week. I'm looking forward to this episode and seeing how prom play out. I also can't wait to see who they decided to bring back. I wonder if anyone from Bonnie's family will come back? Like grams? Bonnie is probably going to have a bunch of confrontations with Elena this episode, especially if Elena is really trying to ruin prom and everyone's fun like the synopsis and webclips we saw are right.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:48 pm

4x19 was a good episode for Bamon. There was no dance (boo!) but I liked the little moments of communication and of course Silas warning Damon off Bonnie. Totally squee-worthy Very Happy

Have any of you guys seen Stefan The Bamon Fanboy posts on tumblr? Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Fri Apr 19, 2013 11:23 pm

Bamon was awesome this episode. Loved how she came to Damon when she figured out Silas was posing as Jeremy. I also loved how there have been three people who came to Damon about Bonnie lol. Vaughn captured Damon to use him as bait or something for Bonnie(I forgot what the reason was, lol). Shane tried to get Damon to not kill him, and used Bonnie losing control of her powers as the reason. Silas came to Damon and told him Bonnie was his.

Bamon FTW!
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Fri Apr 19, 2013 11:38 pm

deathly- it was pretty awesome. not what us bamon fans expected but it was really great subtle stuff. i also loved how he was eager to fix that silas problem and was concerned about silas manipulating bonnie again. and how he laughed about elena feeling that ass whooping in the morning. lol

I do follow the stefan the bamon fanboy tag. it is so hilarious. who are you on tumblr?

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:59 pm

That was a pretty spectacular ass whooping lol. I saw this gif that was like, to Elena from Bonnie, bitch you tried me or something like that lol. Had me laughing my ass off.
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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:34 pm

Lol, yes I saw that it's quite hilarious.

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PostSubject: Re: Bonnie and Damon   Mon Apr 22, 2013 8:39 pm

http://indeathonly.tumblr.com/post/48318676295/to-elena-gilbert-from-bonnie-bennett

LOL that is hilarious right? She really kicked her ass, no lie lol. I wonder how this will affect her friendship with both Bonnie and Caroline, since she has tried to kill both of them? But damn, Bonnie went hardcore on her ass, she wasn't taking no prisoners lol. I want her to say bitch you tried me, and you paid the price for your mistake. I'm not Caroline. LOL, I want her to have a badass speech lol. Like kat in s2, when she told Stefan she would kill everyone Elena loves while Elena watches, then she'll kill Elena while Stefan watches.
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